Japanese Gardening Forums 日本の園芸フォーラム

Front Desk- Open To Public => General Discussion => Topic started by: kobold on June 05, 2010, 09:14:28 PM

Title: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 05, 2010, 09:14:28 PM
For years I was looking at fences to replace our old fence. We repaired for many years because we liked the gray, weathered cedar. No more. A big storm killed the fence beyond repair. Yesterday I noticed this fence, loved it. It is not traditional "Japanese fence", but have a nice feeling for that. I loved the idea how they varied different settings. It is a big house in an area where usually no fence at the front, but this house is on the corner, now  they have more privacy. The high fence part gives cover for the "meditation patio" I made photo of.
Andrea
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 05, 2010, 09:15:10 PM
more pictures
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 05, 2010, 09:15:53 PM
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Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 05, 2010, 09:16:56 PM
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Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 05, 2010, 09:17:36 PM
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Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 05, 2010, 09:18:25 PM
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Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 05, 2010, 09:19:06 PM
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Title: Re: Fence
Post by: Jando on June 06, 2010, 05:48:41 AM
Andrea, that is one great looking fence.  And it also looks like it would last for many years, which is really important.  I think it would work beautifully for you.

June
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: don on June 06, 2010, 09:15:43 AM
I think it would work also.  I would tend to use a roof-like cap on all of it to tie the different styles together.  The color also helps it stick as well. The base stones would be better if they were burried half-way i think.

BTW, this is not a cheap fence!
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 06, 2010, 08:40:56 PM
too bad, I can't afford it and be honest, I don't need such an elaborate fence. I just posted it for everybody to enjoy it.

Our situation with the fence turned into very urgent, today early morning a black bear visited us, ate all the bird feed, tried the big red glass hummingbird feeder too,  climbed over the gate and now that is finished  too.
We need 70' long fence on a gentle slop with one gate,  I will use the wide board, horizontal, only the gate with the nicest pattern. A very simple roofed gate, just two boards for the roof. I hope that will be finished in Aug-Sept. and I can post pictures.
Andrea
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: don on June 06, 2010, 09:05:10 PM
Andrea!  I am without words...
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 20, 2010, 02:40:21 PM
This is the sketch for the gate from the backyard to the back lane. We don't use it often but we see it from the dining-room.
What is the correct proportion?  Is there any rule or just the feeling as we look at it? Some gate look too tall or too bulky.
This has to be a light, the roof part almost like the roof on a fence, just to give a nice closure.

Measurements:  a. the height of the fence  5'
                      b.  the height between the fence and the gate   1'
                      c.  the height between the top of the gate and the roof,  2'
                      e.   width of the gate      5'

Questions:        a+b+c= shouldn't be more than 8' , is it OK?
                       d. less than 1' or 1' ?
                       f.  1,5 ' or less?

any help would be appreciated.
Andrea
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 20, 2010, 02:43:32 PM
it is the view from the window, DH. is holding the part of the old, broken gate to see the height. It was 8'.
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: edzard on June 20, 2010, 11:49:46 PM
Andrea.. how tall are you?

is the gate to be intimate space, private gate, or public gate, 'outside space'. Back alley or front roadway?         edzard
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 21, 2010, 01:48:16 AM
Edzard,

thank you for the questions, to think about points.  First of all most of the people on the Forum aren't perfectionist like you. Few of us can create a " Japanese garden" in the purest form. I know from my experience that I won't. What I like from the Japanese style is the simple lines, harmony with the plants and rocks mixed with my " feeling good about my garden". As I seen pictures posted on the forum, there are many gardens people are proud of and you won't approve it. It is OK.

Why I asked about the proportions? I've seen lots of different gates, many of them  "just didn't look right".  I would like to copy something from a book, but I'm not willing to spend ten thousands on a bamboo fence or put a gate inside my yard where it just would look stupid.  I need the gate at the top of the garden, going out to the back lane. We never come in through that gate, just go out to do some pruning or watering the  plants outside.

Why we admire the Japanese style? It evolved during hundreds of years, followed tradition and observation, religion and myth, practice,  necessity  and needs until it became perfect.  You have to know all the rules because you are a professional garden designer. It is hard for you to see something what isn't perfect. 

I never claimed to have a Japanese garden. I will have this fence because I like the style and the color. And I need a gate to go to the back alley with no more road from it, in a cul de sac, next to the ravine and trees, bears, coyotes...etc.

BTW I'm  165 cm tall and shrinking.

Andrea
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: edzard on June 21, 2010, 02:36:35 PM
Andrea..
i am not a perfectionist, far from it. I only try to do good work and find the best answer.

you are 165cm tall:
then for an intimate gate (is this what you want? you did not say...)
the width is 1/2 to 2/3rd's your height = 83cm to 120cm wide
-- also depends on what goes in or out the gate.
a 7' interior space is good for most gates
Then add the drop of the roof from side view /\

the shallower the roof slope the gentler it looks.
at 8 feet for the old gate, then a shallow roof slope of 1 foot might work.
if nothing goes in or out, then make it smaller for comfort and go 6'6" opening and add 1'6" of roof slope. This equals 8'. (around 2 meters 60cm)
Please note that this size is suddenly the same size as a northern tatami mat. This means the width is a known ratio for a person.
Then 1 meter wide would be good for one person and one meter 60cm would be good for 2 people.

I hope this helps        edzard
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: edzard on June 21, 2010, 02:46:21 PM
your measurement F,
is irrelevant because the slope determines the roof width or coverage.
I do not have enough information of how much roof coverage you need.

the only measure, is what you see from the side and it is one foot six inches high and seven feet of headroom.
What angle from a side view is gentle to you?
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 26, 2010, 09:43:52 PM
Edzard,

yes, it helps!
Intimate gate? We can call that, it is not a grandiose front gate, it  is not inside the garden leading into a special place but at the back, mostly out of sight, but in the view from the house.
Our garden is a woodland garden, wild, lots of rocks, driftwood and cedar branches used for rails and support. The whole area is under work now, but here is an example.
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 26, 2010, 09:46:23 PM
I found some beautiful gates, but this too are the most we like and goes with our style.
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 26, 2010, 09:49:14 PM
this one is smaller, I like it, but the lattice on the gate.  Our builder is trying to get the natural posts for it.
Andrea
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: Jando on June 27, 2010, 08:20:49 AM
Andrea, is the first photo of the three you posted in your garden?  And if so I think it is very cool the way the material was used.

June
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on June 27, 2010, 12:50:04 PM
June

yes, it is. Cedar branches have amazing curved, bending shape. When people cut down or top these trees in our neighborhood  I  ask for the branches and use them. When I built these steps all by myself 10-15 years ago ( and all the rock work ) I had lots of energy.  Not any more! Here is an other rail from the garden.
Andrea
Title: Re: Fence and Japanese gate finished!!!!
Post by: kobold on September 11, 2010, 12:13:14 AM
I don't even know where to start!  After planing the project, finding somebody to build it, actively participating, now just more work to finish the landscape around it, I can say that the Japanese gate is finished.
We had lots of problems. The builder we used can work in construction, but he isn't a woodworker. I emailed sketches, pictures to him, but he didn't look at it. I had to be there, correct him ( you can imagine him to be happy!), change the damaged boards he wanted to use, etc. He missed to measure the fence panels correctly, we had to move the gate further, into the rhododendron bush almost, otherwise the two panels next to the gate would have to be different size. For everything I criticized he said "oh, you wont see that". I assured him that I see and notice everything. But we survived it, at the end I just got tired to argue with him or ask him to redo things. The same guy made that dark brown fence what I posted at the beginning of this tread. It is so different if you can do it for yourself, give the time to do correctly.   

Now we have to work on the stairs, stepping stones, plants he destroyed.  As you can see from the pictures, we loved the cedar, didn't want to stain yet, we will see.

Had a wonderful time in July visiting my son in  W.Australia, fishing, traveling. Now heading to Europe for 4 weeks, the landscape can wait .

Andrea
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: kobold on September 11, 2010, 12:15:04 AM
from the back lane
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: Jando on September 11, 2010, 06:16:05 AM
Andrea, sounds like you were living a nightmare.  Enjoy your vacation.

June
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: peterm on September 26, 2010, 06:17:50 PM
Perhaps Terry can post the information on his gate.  It's one of the nicest I have seen and is very close to what they have in Japan
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: hecube on March 06, 2011, 09:12:54 PM
more

What kind of trees are between the deck and the fence?
Title: Re: Fence
Post by: don on March 07, 2011, 09:57:39 AM
She may still be travelling, but i am going to guess they may be maples?